The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The End?

16 Sep 2008 - 12:43pm
6 years ago
129 replies
4241 reads
Sharon Greenfield5
2008

What say you, people of IXDA?

What say you of the new Facebook design?

What of the usability of this new look? What of the spacing? Is it
efficient? Are the tabs necessary? Or did you like to, with just one
look, understand a person's personal and professional life completely?

More importantly, with the myriad of complaints of said new design,
will this bring the downfall of Facebook here in the US? Into the
halls of history along with Tribe, Friendster, Orkut?

Comments

17 Sep 2008 - 7:09am
SemanticWill
2007

Personally, doesn't matter.

Facebook is 15 minutes ago. Facebook is useless. Facebook just doesn't have
the decency to realize that it is Friendster 5 years ago.

On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 2:43 PM, live <human.factor.one at gmail.com> wrote:

> What say you, people of IXDA?
>
> What say you of the new Facebook design?
>
> What of the usability of this new look? What of the spacing? Is it
> efficient? Are the tabs necessary? Or did you like to, with just one look,
> understand a person's personal and professional life completely?
>
> More importantly, with the myriad of complaints of said new design, will
> this bring the downfall of Facebook here in the US? Into the halls of
> history along with Tribe, Friendster, Orkut?
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 7:00am
pyces
2007

I dislike the new design immensely. I am asked to enter not 1, but 2
security word graphics to send a message to a friend (that I actually
know, but haven't added via Facebook yet). One is hard enough! I
thought, how on earth can I stop this? Why, they tell you, right on the
screen, verify your profile (or words to that effect). Why on earth, to
verify my profile, would I need to enter my mobile number, then enter a
text message code that they send me. How does that "verify" me? By the
way, the text message code they sent didn't work - invalid code. I was
welcome to pay for another text message but there was no other way to
verify myself. This doesn't make sense. Just because you use the net
doesn't mean you have a mobile phone!! What about people who don't have
mobile phones? What about people who don't buy text messages (like me)?
Why can't you verify yourself via any other method? Why on earth do you
have to verify yourself anyway - this isn't an e-signing of a loan
application or some sensitive, confidential document. They've made this
site way too difficult to use. I won't be back anytime soon.

I like the way LinkedIn does it where you specify how you know the
person, if you have an existing relationship with the person outside of
Facebook. Facebook could use: Elementary School, Middle School (Junior
High), High School, College, Grad School, Work, Daycare, Neighborhood.
For people you don't know but want to know, you could just send a
message. No need for security code graphics, no need to make the user
experience difficult.

Courtney Jordan
User Experience

-----Original Message-----
From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com [mailto:discuss-

What say you of the new Facebook design?

What of the usability of this new look? What of the spacing? Is it
efficient? Are the tabs necessary? Or did you like to, with just one
look, understand a person's personal and professional life completely?

More importantly, with the myriad of complaints of said new design,
will this bring the downfall of Facebook here in the US? Into the
halls of history along with Tribe, Friendster, Orkut?

17 Sep 2008 - 7:13am
Scott McDaniel
2007

Did poor UX kill (or at least stymie) Orkut, Friendster, etc?

If so, why in God's green Earth is MySpace still on the internets?

Scott

On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 2:43 PM, live <human.factor.one at gmail.com> wrote:
> What say you, people of IXDA?
>
> What say you of the new Facebook design?
>
> What of the usability of this new look? What of the spacing? Is it
> efficient? Are the tabs necessary? Or did you like to, with just one look,
> understand a person's personal and professional life completely?
>
> More importantly, with the myriad of complaints of said new design, will
> this bring the downfall of Facebook here in the US? Into the halls of
> history along with Tribe, Friendster, Orkut?

--
* It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
Pausch

17 Sep 2008 - 8:45am
Benjamin Ho
2007

The problem isn't the new design - it's that it changed too fast. I
think Jared Spool's article about Embraceable Change says it all.

As for the actual Facebook, compared to Linked-In and MySpace, it's
much better. I think what FB is trying to do is add more features.
For instance, now you can make comments on people's status. Which I
think is a great idea because now, you're opening up the conversation
a little more.

And now, the applications are put into the back-burner, in a sense.
They're still accessible but takes a little more work to do so.

One thing I don't like are the tabs, but that doesn't mean they're
not useful. I'm sure some people would like to just concentrate on
"photos".

All in all, I don't mind the changes (even though at first I was
resistant to them myself) and with any change, it takes time to get
acclimated. FB just didn't give everyone enough time for that.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 8:58am
Mark Schraad
2006

Many many introductory products eventually become merely a feature of
a more purposed product they are piggybacking upon. There are
countless examples of this in technology.

My space and linkedin represent purposed social sites... they
facilitate finding new music (or being found) and building
professional networks. The real power of social networks is as
attached to a goal, passion or need.

I participate on facebook minimally as my family and some coworkers
become acquainted with the social web, but I am not sure there is much
else here. It is an interesting and effective way to reconnect with
lost friends from high school and college.

So Will... have you moved on to Plaxo?

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:09 AM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com> wrote:
> Personally, doesn't matter.
>
> Facebook is 15 minutes ago. Facebook is useless. Facebook just doesn't have
> the decency to realize that it is Friendster 5 years ago.
>
> On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 2:43 PM, live <human.factor.one at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> What say you, people of IXDA?
>>
>> What say you of the new Facebook design?
>>
>> What of the usability of this new look? What of the spacing? Is it
>> efficient? Are the tabs necessary? Or did you like to, with just one look,
>> understand a person's personal and professional life completely?
>>
>> More importantly, with the myriad of complaints of said new design, will
>> this bring the downfall of Facebook here in the US? Into the halls of
>> history along with Tribe, Friendster, Orkut?
>> ________________________________________________________________
>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
>> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
>> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ~ will
>
> "Where you innovate, how you innovate,
> and what you innovate are design problems"
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Will Evans | User Experience Architect
> tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
> aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
> twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 9:23am
Jef Lippiatt
2008

Weighing in.
Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
Yahoo, aka Geocities.
All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
them sometimes within hours or minutes.
In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 9:32am
Patrick Barrett
2006

Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream audience--something no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how they can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is a smart move.

Patrick Barrett

-----Original Message-----
From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com [mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On Behalf Of jeff lippiatt
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 3:24 AM
To: discuss at ixda.org
Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The End?

Weighing in.
Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
Yahoo, aka Geocities.
All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
them sometimes within hours or minutes.
In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

________________________________________________________________
Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help

17 Sep 2008 - 9:36am
SemanticWill
2007

How are they relevant and how do you define mainstream? Everyone (except me)
goes there - for what purpose?

I wonder how they might monetize their eyeballs relative to others, and why
they even matter? I argue they don't, and they can't.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:32 AM, Patrick Barrett
<Patrick at bazaarvoice.com>wrote:

> Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream audience--something
> no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership
> continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how they
> can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is a
> smart move.
>
> Patrick Barrett
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com [mailto:
> discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On Behalf Of jeff lippiatt
> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 3:24 AM
> To: discuss at ixda.org
> Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The
> End?
>
> Weighing in.
> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 9:41am
Scott McDaniel
2007

I think we're seeing it become more relevant as they've grown
decoupled from people being On Facebook and into other services.
I agree that apps and such are little blips in the overall picture,
but the amount of social news (and tbh, noise) I get via integrated
social networks is staggering - I can only imagine moreso for people
ten years younger than me.
I find statements of many of these things being obsolete to be hard to
grasp for me, as I think we have the benefit of living on the edge of
things and ~should~ be looking beyond. Despite this, I think it's
forgetting where the rest of the online population, and the
yet-to-be-online population lives.

Scott

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:32 AM, Patrick Barrett
<Patrick at bazaarvoice.com> wrote:
> Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream audience--something no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how they can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is a smart move.
>
> Patrick Barrett
>

--
* It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
Pausch

17 Sep 2008 - 9:43am
lachica
2006

I'm in my late 30s and just signed up for Facebook. I'm also seeing many
people in my age range signing up including friends I haven't talked to in
10 years. Although it's much less relevant to my life since Scrabulous is
gone it is still a compelling site. The draw is completely related to the
network of friends and, as such, the new design is irrelevant.

Cheers,
Julie

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 10:36 AM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com>wrote:

> How are they relevant and how do you define mainstream? Everyone (except
> me)
> goes there - for what purpose?
>
> I wonder how they might monetize their eyeballs relative to others, and why
> they even matter? I argue they don't, and they can't.
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:32 AM, Patrick Barrett
> <Patrick at bazaarvoice.com>wrote:
>
> > Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream
> audience--something
> > no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership
> > continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how
> they
> > can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is
> a
> > smart move.
> >
> > Patrick Barrett
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com [mailto:
> > discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com] On Behalf Of jeff
> lippiatt
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 3:24 AM
> > To: discuss at ixda.org
> > Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of
> The
> > End?
> >
> > Weighing in.
> > Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
> > Yahoo, aka Geocities.
> > All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
> > of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
> > entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
> > was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
> > annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
> > over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
> > declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
> > catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
> > snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
> > incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
> > down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
> > them sometimes within hours or minutes.
> > In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
> > abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
> > entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
> > I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
> > use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
> > pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
> >
> >
> > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> > Posted from the new ixda.org
> > http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
> >
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> > To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> > Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> > List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> > List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> > To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> > Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> > List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> > List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
> >
>
>
>
> --
> ~ will
>
> "Where you innovate, how you innovate,
> and what you innovate are design problems"
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Will Evans | User Experience Architect
> tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
> aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
> twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 9:43am
Patrick Barrett
2006

They are relevant in that they provide a platform for everyone to get and stay connected with anyone they have ever known. I am defining mainstream as non cutting edge (read fickle) users. By appealing to tech laggards there is less risk that they suffer the fate of Friendster. Inertia will work in their favor.

Patrick V. Barrett

From: wkevans4 at gmail.com [mailto:wkevans4 at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Will Evans
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 10:36 AM
To: Patrick Barrett
Cc: jeff lippiatt; discuss at ixda.org
Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The End?

How are they relevant and how do you define mainstream? Everyone (except me) goes there - for what purpose?

I wonder how they might monetize their eyeballs relative to others, and why they even matter? I argue they don't, and they can't.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:32 AM, Patrick Barrett <Patrick at bazaarvoice.com<mailto:Patrick at bazaarvoice.com>> wrote:
Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream audience--something no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how they can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is a smart move.

Patrick Barrett

-----Original Message-----
From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com<mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com> [mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com<mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com>] On Behalf Of jeff lippiatt
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 3:24 AM
To: discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The End?

Weighing in.
Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
Yahoo, aka Geocities.
All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
them sometimes within hours or minutes.
In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org<http://ixda.org>
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

________________________________________________________________
Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
________________________________________________________________
Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com<mailto:will at semanticfoundry.com>
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 9:53am
SemanticWill
2007

So an address book?

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:43 AM, Patrick Barrett
<Patrick at bazaarvoice.com>wrote:

> They are relevant in that they provide a platform for everyone to get and
> stay connected with anyone they have ever known. I am defining mainstream as
> non cutting edge (read fickle) users. By appealing to tech laggards there is
> less risk that they suffer the fate of Friendster. Inertia will work in
> their favor.
>
> Patrick V. Barrett
>
>
> From: wkevans4 at gmail.com [mailto:wkevans4 at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Will
> Evans
> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 10:36 AM
> To: Patrick Barrett
> Cc: jeff lippiatt; discuss at ixda.org
> Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The
> End?
>
> How are they relevant and how do you define mainstream? Everyone (except
> me) goes there - for what purpose?
>
> I wonder how they might monetize their eyeballs relative to others, and why
> they even matter? I argue they don't, and they can't.
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:32 AM, Patrick Barrett <Patrick at bazaarvoice.com
> <mailto:Patrick at bazaarvoice.com>> wrote:
> Facebook is just now becoming relevant to a mainstream audience--something
> no other social network has done before. Their traffic and membership
> continue to grow at a pretty good clip. I don't have the answer for how they
> can monetize their traffic, but I think moving beyond college students is a
> smart move.
>
> Patrick Barrett
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com<mailto:
> discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com> [mailto:
> discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com<mailto:
> discuss-bounces at lists.interactiondesigners.com>] On Behalf Of jeff
> lippiatt
> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 3:24 AM
> To: discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
> Subject: Re: [IxDA Discuss] The New Facebook Redesign: The Beginning of The
> End?
>
> Weighing in.
> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org<http://ixda.org>
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org<mailto:discuss at ixda.org>
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>
>
>
> --
> ~ will
>
> "Where you innovate, how you innovate,
> and what you innovate are design problems"
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Will Evans | User Experience Architect
> tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com<mailto:
> will at semanticfoundry.com>
> aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
> twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 10:53am
Andri Sigurðsson
2008

Hmm yes, something went wrong here. I think people will continue to use Facebook for a few months/years but the redesign was a fail.

The new design does not look any better then the old one. They changed too much in the navigation structure making some features hard to find again.

I agree about the Embraceable Change point.

17 Sep 2008 - 11:20am
Benjamin Ho
2007

Wow. I can't believe quite a few of you are so ready to piss on
Facebook. I find it quite incredible!

Do people really hate their past relationships so much that they have
to hate everything about Facebook? I also don't see the relevance of
Geocities - I've never heard of them other than possibly being a
Yahoo entity of some sort.

I think there's something to be said of Facebook and its success of
bringing people back together "after many years".

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 11:26am
Scott McDaniel
2007

My address book never enabled people I didn't want to remember from
high school to give
me daily updates on their political views and dog's eczema, okay?

Scott

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com> wrote:
> So an address book?
>
>

--
* It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
Pausch

17 Sep 2008 - 11:31am
SemanticWill
2007

I am sure that in some twisted parallel universe where there are no books to
read, ideas to explore, things to build, people to meet, Facebook is really
compelling. Really.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Scott McDaniel <scott at scottopic.com> wrote:

> My address book never enabled people I didn't want to remember from
> high school to give
> me daily updates on their political views and dog's eczema, okay?
>
> Scott
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com>
> wrote:
> > So an address book?
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> * It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
> it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
> Pausch
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 11:27am
SemanticWill
2007

What are the top three user goals when they go onto facebook?

Super-poking? Is that a goal?

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:20 PM, Benjamin Ho <benoh2 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Wow. I can't believe quite a few of you are so ready to piss on
> Facebook. I find it quite incredible!
>
> Do people really hate their past relationships so much that they have
> to hate everything about Facebook? I also don't see the relevance of
> Geocities - I've never heard of them other than possibly being a
> Yahoo entity of some sort.
>
> I think there's something to be said of Facebook and its success of
> bringing people back together "after many years".
>
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 11:38am
Scott McDaniel
2007

We're obviously stepping on some deep-seated stuff here, so I'll bow out.

Scott

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:31 PM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com> wrote:
> I am sure that in some twisted parallel universe where there are no books to
> read, ideas to explore, things to build, people to meet, Facebook is really
> compelling. Really.
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:26 PM, Scott McDaniel <scott at scottopic.com> wrote:
>>
>> My address book never enabled people I didn't want to remember from
>> high school to give
>> me daily updates on their political views and dog's eczema, okay?
>>
>> Scott

--
* It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
Pausch

17 Sep 2008 - 11:44am
Jef Lippiatt
2008

Yahoo's old school Geocities, is relevant because it was one of the
first pushes to have "personal homepages" it was supposed to be
basically what facebook is but 10 years ago, without all the apps,
widgets, social connections. It was more like Myspace in the sense
that it was a WYSIWYG editor format that looked down right terrible.
Which is why myspace can be completely an eyesore when people start
doing the clip art and loading widgets that eat your bandwidth, and
if Facebook opens up anymore and lets users start doing that as well,
their plummet will speed up. Just because both services are making
lots of money does not mean they are doing things correctly at all.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 11:46am
Loren Baxter
2007

I find Twitter almost worthless... because none of my friends use it. They
all use Facebook. This doesn't mean that I will declare Twitter a lost
cause.

Facebook is a pillar of social life in college. I can see how people from
generations and networks that were only recently opened up to Facebook might
struggle with the service, but it's important to understand that The Book is
so integrated into the social life at universities these days that it's not
going anywhere soon. The usefulness of a social network to any person is
directly correlated to how much your network uses that service.

The photo tagging feature alone makes it worth it. I didn't even have a
camera for two years and have hundreds of photos thanks to the tagging.
Sharing photos, posting stories, communicating with friends, planning &
rsvping events, reconnecting with old friends, seeing activity in your
network, using dumb apps - aren't these valid "goals" that people might have
coming to the site?

17 Sep 2008 - 11:48am
Alvin Woon
2007

hi all,
yeah, i think this thread has somewhat turned into a collection of personal
views of what facebook is to certain individuals.

Regardless of their business model or what's going on there, in terms of
interaction design, Facebook has set a decent example on what good
interaction design can bring. They dedicate a lot of resources and
attentions to aspects of good design practices, which is something we should
be talking about in the first place. They have a solid team to boot and I
personally admire some of their works/papers.

Some people always bring up the 'if good design is important, then why
MySpace is on top' argument. I'm sure some of you in here can argue against
that better than I can.

As for the redesign, I think it's a design for user experience. Remember the
not-so-old days when 100 applications get mixed up with everything else?

Personally, I don't think facebook works for me; I am looking to derive more
values out of my social networking experiences. But for what they do and the
way they do it, as someone who works in the interaction design field, my
hats off to them.

- Alvin

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:20 PM, Benjamin Ho <benoh2 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Wow. I can't believe quite a few of you are so ready to piss on
> Facebook. I find it quite incredible!
>
> Do people really hate their past relationships so much that they have
> to hate everything about Facebook? I also don't see the relevance of
> Geocities - I've never heard of them other than possibly being a
> Yahoo entity of some sort.
>
> I think there's something to be said of Facebook and its success of
> bringing people back together "after many years".
>
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 11:56am
Benjamin Ho
2007

I do agree that there is quite a bit of clutter in FB and that there
still needs to be work done to it. I haven't had the privilege of
using Geocities so I have nothing to compare it to. I think that the
fact that Geocities didn't really take off "into mainstream" was
because it wasn't its time. There's a reason for everything.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 12:00pm
SemanticWill
2007

Why didn't you have a geocities account? Just wonderin... we all did back in
95

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:56 PM, Benjamin Ho <benoh2 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I do agree that there is quite a bit of clutter in FB and that there
> still needs to be work done to it. I haven't had the privilege of
> using Geocities so I have nothing to compare it to. I think that the
> fact that Geocities didn't really take off "into mainstream" was
> because it wasn't its time. There's a reason for everything.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
~ will

"Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems"

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.128 | will at semanticfoundry.com
aim: semanticwill | gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

17 Sep 2008 - 12:03pm
Benjamin Ho
2007

I think Loren hit the nail on the head - A social site is useless if
your friends don't use it.

I thought Twitter was useless until I started using it, and you have
to use it often to get any value from it. If you want to connect
with people, it takes a bit of effort to do so, just the physical
boundaries are broken down - such is the nature of the Internet.

I think this is where the tool is only as good as the people using
it.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 12:03pm
Mark Schraad
2006

I have this kind of comment regarding craigslist as well. I am not
sure that user adoption isn't one measure of good design. When in fact
it is probably a more valuable metric than any sort of CA similar
'design award'.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:48 PM, Alvin Woon <alvinwoon at gmail.com> wrote:

> Some people always bring up the 'if good design is important, then why
> MySpace is on top' argument. I'm sure some of you in here can argue against
> that better than I can.

17 Sep 2008 - 12:12pm
Benjamin Ho
2007

Will,

Let's see..1995...I had just gotten off AOL and CompuServe because
it was costing a fortune to be a member. I had also stopped running
my BBS because of trolls polluting the space.

And I had just started my schooling for Industrial Design..which
inevitably led me to being in Usability and the whole Interaction
Design scene...so..I was a bit more busy back then - no time for
Geocities.

And I was using Lycos as a search engine.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 12:19pm
Dave Malouf
2005

Hello I'm David Malouf, I've been a Facebook user for 3 years now.
... "Hello, David!"

Seriously, FB serves many purposes for me:
1) An amazing auto-updated addressbook ala Plaxo. Why is that a BAD
thing?
2) A twitter like status update, that doesn't have the heavy
conversational aspect of Twitter, but still NOW has commenting on
statuses.
3) A means of connecting with people on topics, around events, and
other "meta" data that is harder in other social apps that I'm a
part of.
4) It has growingly become the platform of choice of many to share
media and links both to specific groups but also to the wider world.

As for the mainstream approach. TV is mainstream pretty unarguably,
but I know a ton of people who don't own or ever watch a TV. In this
sense Facebook is gaining towards becoming mainstream. E.g. There is a
Dentyne ad on the subways here in NYC that uses the phrase "Accept
Friendship" taken straight out of facebook. The system in essence is
reaching the "verb" level of mainstream amongst a very wide
audience, like when the verb "Google" started being used in TV
shows. And conversely we KNOW that when someone says yahoo or MSN
search that it was paid for. ;-)

Now to the design. I likey. can't really explain it to be honest. I
don't have all the words for it. What I do know is that it hides
stuff or allows me to hide stuff that I don't want like all the apps
and groups and shit I barely use if ever. But the more people complain
about "new FB" the more I shiver with the thought of going back to
"old FB".

I think people are being ultra-critical, sensitive, and negative
unnecessarily.

-- dave

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 12:21pm
AJ Kock
2007

Just because Friendster is dead in the USA, it doesn't mean it is dead
in the rest of the world. It is extremely popular in Malaysia and
surrounding countries. 80 Million users is far from dead.

17 Sep 2008 - 12:28pm
Christine Boese
2006

Just to note a different perspective here, since the bias of this
professional group may be creating a bit of a blind spot, both about
Facebook, and indirectly, about Geocities.

I did my dissertation ethnography of a grassroots cyberculture community in
the mid-90s. The goal of the study (as for all such studies) was to learn
from the COMMUNITY what tools and interfaces and interactions were
empowering for the community, and which were not. The community had to teach
me, and I avoided imposing my own beliefs about certain tools on their
perceptions. I collected data.

I can tell you (and this is replicated in many online communities of the
day), Geocities and Simplenet, and the others were ESSENTIAL for the
community to even to exist, to even coalesce and become empowered to do what
they did. They meant EVERYTHING to these grassroots, REAL online communities
(as opposed to communities manufactured by marketing people).

The SNEERS of professional interface designers meant nothing to them. The
grassroots was empowered by a clunky tool, and took it, and exploded,
accomplished its goals, and far exceeded them.

I'm sure many would say the same of the butt ugly MySpace as well, and
Facebook, Tribe, Friendster, et al.

So to step back for a moment, to think about real audiences, users,
communities, vibrant cybercultures, and how dare they presume to exist and
use tools without our benevolent blessing and permission! What nerve of
them! <G> How dare those cats resist our herding!

LOL. I like to think about a similar disconnect raised in other times, in
other places, as elites cite the superior quality of whatever sophisticated
technology they are touting, as a widespread, grassroots wildfire seizes
upon a weaker, lesser tool, because it is immediately accessable to them,
and can be quickly and easily appropriated for their needs.

Funny how sometimes the self appointed high priest class so strongly resists
the tearing apart of the curtain to the Holy of Holies.

Here's the beginnings of a list:

weak pathetic PCs vs. superior powerful mainframes

HTML vs. SGML

pathetic VHS vs. Beta

Apple vs PC

Messy Inky Printing Press Books vs. gorgeous, scriptoria-copied,
Monk-created illuminated manuscripts

2,000-character sets of hieroglyphs readable only by an elite priest class
vs.20+ character syllabic alphabets that could be read by slaves and forment
revolution

Chris

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:56 PM, Benjamin Ho <benoh2 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I do agree that there is quite a bit of clutter in FB and that there
> still needs to be work done to it. I haven't had the privilege of
> using Geocities so I have nothing to compare it to. I think that the
> fact that Geocities didn't really take off "into mainstream" was
> because it wasn't its time. There's a reason for everything.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 12:39pm
Mark Canlas
2003

Programmers and software folk have a term for this, although the web page
where I first encountered it escapes me. It's roughly referred to as the
"Jersey method" vs the "MIT way" of doing things.

The Jersey method often means doing things in a quick, ad-hoc, messy manner.
Super practical and ugly looking, akin to the highway system (or lack
thereof, har har) in the state of New Jersey.

On the other end of the design spectrum is the MIT way, the exact way you
wish you did something after encountering all of the warts in the Jersey
method. It's perfect, clean, and without flaw.

The Jersey method often prevails because it is always in working condition,
although maybe not the best condition. The MIT way tends to end up remaining
an idea without an implementation.

So will bad design kill Facebook because it doesn't resemble the most MIT
way of interaction and design? Probably not, because it still gets the job
done and that's very Jersey.

By the way, Loren, you absolutely nailed it.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 2:28 PM, Christine Boese
<christine.boese at gmail.com>wrote:

> Just to note a different perspective here, since the bias of this
> professional group may be creating a bit of a blind spot, both about
> Facebook, and indirectly, about Geocities.
>
> I did my dissertation ethnography of a grassroots cyberculture community in
> the mid-90s. The goal of the study (as for all such studies) was to learn
> from the COMMUNITY what tools and interfaces and interactions were
> empowering for the community, and which were not. The community had to
> teach
> me, and I avoided imposing my own beliefs about certain tools on their
> perceptions. I collected data.
>
> I can tell you (and this is replicated in many online communities of the
> day), Geocities and Simplenet, and the others were ESSENTIAL for the
> community to even to exist, to even coalesce and become empowered to do
> what
> they did. They meant EVERYTHING to these grassroots, REAL online
> communities
> (as opposed to communities manufactured by marketing people).
>
> The SNEERS of professional interface designers meant nothing to them. The
> grassroots was empowered by a clunky tool, and took it, and exploded,
> accomplished its goals, and far exceeded them.
>
> I'm sure many would say the same of the butt ugly MySpace as well, and
> Facebook, Tribe, Friendster, et al.
>
> So to step back for a moment, to think about real audiences, users,
> communities, vibrant cybercultures, and how dare they presume to exist and
> use tools without our benevolent blessing and permission! What nerve of
> them! <G> How dare those cats resist our herding!
>
> LOL. I like to think about a similar disconnect raised in other times, in
> other places, as elites cite the superior quality of whatever sophisticated
> technology they are touting, as a widespread, grassroots wildfire seizes
> upon a weaker, lesser tool, because it is immediately accessable to them,
> and can be quickly and easily appropriated for their needs.
>
> Funny how sometimes the self appointed high priest class so strongly
> resists
> the tearing apart of the curtain to the Holy of Holies.
>
> Here's the beginnings of a list:
>
> weak pathetic PCs vs. superior powerful mainframes
>
> HTML vs. SGML
>
> pathetic VHS vs. Beta
>
> Apple vs PC
>
> Messy Inky Printing Press Books vs. gorgeous, scriptoria-copied,
> Monk-created illuminated manuscripts
>
> 2,000-character sets of hieroglyphs readable only by an elite priest class
> vs.20+ character syllabic alphabets that could be read by slaves and
> forment
> revolution
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:56 PM, Benjamin Ho <benoh2 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > I do agree that there is quite a bit of clutter in FB and that there
> > still needs to be work done to it. I haven't had the privilege of
> > using Geocities so I have nothing to compare it to. I think that the
> > fact that Geocities didn't really take off "into mainstream" was
> > because it wasn't its time. There's a reason for everything.
> >
> >
> > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> > Posted from the new ixda.org
> > http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
> >
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> > To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> > Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> > List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> > List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
> >
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 2:39pm
Mark Young
2008

> "So an address book?"

Yes, which is certainly a valuable thing that becomes radically more
valuable when you add pictures, snippets of personal events, friends
of friends, etc. FB is loved because its added brilliant things to
people's list of friends - you can get a pretty rich gestalt of your
friends' lives on the screen. However, it doesn't work for everyone
- you need to be motivated to put your life on the screen and you
need to have friends who play along.

FB has a couple of design characteristics that trump most other
things. The way the user contributed content (photos, comments, etc.)
and user related notifications (News Feed, etc.) pop out so strongly
makes it feel vital and dynamically representative of your social
circle. Its easy to nitpick the latest redesigns but they haven't
disrupted the key stuff.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 3:24pm
Oleh Kovalchuke
2006

Will Evans wrote:

> What are the top three user goals when they go onto facebook?

1. Gossip
2. Boasting
3. Kvetching
4. (bonus) Stalking

And just like gossip, the Facebook is not going away any time soon.

Will, think about personas, not about yourself.

Cheers,

Oleh Kovalchuke
Interaction Design is design of time
http://www.tangospring.com/IxDtopicWhatIsInteractionDesign.htm

17 Sep 2008 - 10:28am
Anonymous

Will,

By itself, an address book does not help you stay connected. Of
course, you can use your address book to look up someone's phone
number, but, you still need a phone to call them. Or, you can look up
someone's address and send them an e-mail--or (gasp) snail mail--but,
you still need another tool.

The difference between Facebook and an address book is that Facebook
is both a medium for storing contact information and communicating
directly with your contacts.

On Wed, Sep 17 at 8:53 AM, Will Evans wrote:
So an address book?

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 10:36am
Anonymous

The new design is on the whole too repetitive and detailed.

As to the orignal post about tabs. They complicate the what was a
once very simple interaction to view an individuals information at a
glance.

Additionally, the repetition of links in the top is too cry about.
Two Home links exist nest to each other, in the form of the facebook
icon, a usability standard that i do not wish to see different, and a
link that states home, if the house wasnt enough in the first link.
There are also two ways to access my profile, by selecting profile on
the left or my name on the right. Again, do i need that?

As for the spacing the entire thing seems poorly proportioned and the
fact that the layout changes between tabs isnt good.

That being said, I actually am in support of the new facebook and am
not a fan, groupie, or any other facebook application member of any
ban the new facebook design groups. On the whole it is a step forward
for what could be a more cohesive and organized way to have the now
chaotic facebook. Still, there is a lot of work to get everything
consistent again and to gain users trust. I do agree with the earlier
post that it was too much too fast.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 3:30pm
Anonymous

I have to agree with those who blame the fast change as the main
problem. As for the design itself, I must admit that it took me a
couple of days to learn my way through it.

While the design may be still a bit confusing at times, I can see
where they were going. The only thing that I just don't understand
is why the redundancy in their top frame links (Facebook-Home;
Profile-YourName). Anyway, overall, I think they did a pretty good
job. It's great to have a solid social network.

Last.fm did a similar thing about two months ago. They decided to go
for a more Facebook-ish look and the same thing happened... everyone
just went nuts.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

17 Sep 2008 - 4:15pm
Loren Baxter
2007

People have historically resisted change on Facebook. When they released
the News Feed feature (now the doubly-linked Home page), thousands of people
protested and joined groups in a huge backlash. I can't speak for everyone
else, but personally find the newsfeed very useful and engaging. It appears
that, once people got over the kneejerk reaction, many see it the same way.

I wonder why the resistance to change is so high. Is it simply because the
new design is poorer and the effort of relearning the system is annoying?
Or is there also a deeper emotional component, like coming home and finding
that someone has reorganized your room... even if the organization makes
more sense?

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Oscar Lozano <mortem at gmail.com> wrote:

> I have to agree with those who blame the fast change as the main
> problem. As for the design itself, I must admit that it took me a
> couple of days to learn my way through it.
>
> While the design may be still a bit confusing at times, I can see
> where they were going. The only thing that I just don't understand
> is why the redundancy in their top frame links (Facebook-Home;
> Profile-YourName). Anyway, overall, I think they did a pretty good
> job. It's great to have a solid social network.
>
> Last.fm did a similar thing about two months ago. They decided to go
> for a more Facebook-ish look and the same thing happened... everyone
> just went nuts.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 4:55pm
Scott McDaniel
2007

"Nation of whiners" ;)

But seriously, I think a part is that Facebook gives the discontented
an inherent place to voice
their complaints, and dislike is more motivating than "Okay" or "Good",
and change is a harder sell in the "if it ain't broke" viewpoint.

Scott

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 6:15 PM, Loren Baxter <loren.baxter at gmail.com> wrote:
> People have historically resisted change on Facebook. When they released
> the News Feed feature (now the doubly-linked Home page), thousands of people
> protested and joined groups in a huge backlash. I can't speak for everyone
> else, but personally find the newsfeed very useful and engaging. It appears
> that, once people got over the kneejerk reaction, many see it the same way.
>
> I wonder why the resistance to change is so high. Is it simply because the
> new design is poorer and the effort of relearning the system is annoying?
> Or is there also a deeper emotional component, like coming home and finding
> that someone has reorganized your room... even if the organization makes
> more sense?
>

--
* It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
Pausch

17 Sep 2008 - 5:05pm
Troy Gardner
2008

I love the craigslist poke. Just as there is colorblindness, there is also
design blindness, interactive blindness, typography blindness. So many of
the things we fixate on.... users are completely oblivious to, or don't
particularly care about having a high threshold for stuff that would drive
us batty. People who use craigslist's expectations are...they are likely
pretty happy with printed newspaper classified, which I'm sure for most on
this list seem antiquated. For them It's good enough, they don't have to
think much.

I'm am well connected on the web. I myspace with a musician profile and
personal, friendster, orkut, linked in,okcupid, livejournal (180 friends),
lastfm, pandora, mp3.com, have several blogs. .2 Years ago I did a
breakdown of time spent on social networks and rewards received the
conclusion was...I stopped using them for the most part as a frequent social
medium. Like life after TV, I've found that there is still a high quality
of life, and connection with the friends and issues that matter.

Secondly similarly to when giving up TV, I notice that the medium becomes
the ends. e.g. Some Warhammer gamers (addicts) have little in common
outside of warcraft. Same can be said for any consumerism as glue and
increasingly social networks.

17 Sep 2008 - 11:41am
Celeste Cefalu
2007

Walk onto a college or high school campus and ask if facebook is obsolete.

"Facebook became obsolete a while ago."

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 10:26 AM, Scott McDaniel <scott at scottopic.com>wrote:

> My address book never enabled people I didn't want to remember from
> high school to give
> me daily updates on their political views and dog's eczema, okay?
>
> Scott
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Will Evans <will at semanticfoundry.com>
> wrote:
> > So an address book?
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> * It's very important to know when you're in a pissing match. And
> it's very important to get out of it as quickly as possible. - Randy
> Pausch
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

17 Sep 2008 - 9:48pm
Anonymous

In this case, I think that the biggest setback with change is that most
people find annoying the process of re-learning to navigate.
To me their thoughts are somewhere around here - "We're all so used to the
old design, so what's the need for change?"

This reminds me when my grandpa refused to use a computer because his good
ol' ways got the job done. To him there was no need for an upgrade, even
though a computer would have make all his work much easier.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 5:15 PM, Loren Baxter <loren.baxter at gmail.com>wrote:

> People have historically resisted change on Facebook. When they released
> the News Feed feature (now the doubly-linked Home page), thousands of people
> protested and joined groups in a huge backlash. I can't speak for everyone
> else, but personally find the newsfeed very useful and engaging. It appears
> that, once people got over the kneejerk reaction, many see it the same way.
>
> I wonder why the resistance to change is so high. Is it simply because the
> new design is poorer and the effort of relearning the system is annoying?
> Or is there also a deeper emotional component, like coming home and finding
> that someone has reorganized your room... even if the organization makes
> more sense?
>
>
>>
>>
>> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
>> Posted from the new ixda.org
>> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________
>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
>> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
>> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>>
>
>

--
~Ora che ho perso la vista ci vedo di piu...

18 Sep 2008 - 5:04am
AJ Kock
2007

> So to step back for a moment, to think about real audiences, users,
> communities, vibrant cybercultures, and how dare they presume to exist and
> use tools without our benevolent blessing and permission! What nerve of
> them! <G> How dare those cats resist our herding!
>

Well said Christine. People have a tendency to forget the user in
Interaction Design.

19 Sep 2008 - 7:50am
Oleh Kovalchuke
2006

The primary goal is getting concerned with the lives of others.

Listen to McLuhan opinion on "global village" (AKA Facebook) at 15 minutes
in this TED talk on rivalry between TV and computers.
http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/peter_hirshberg_on_tv_and_the_web.html

I call this primary goal "gossip".

--
Oleh Kovalchuke
Interaction Design is design of time
http://www.tangospring.com/IxDtopicWhatIsInteractionDesign.htm

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 4:24 PM, Oleh Kovalchuke <tangospring at gmail.com>wrote:

> Will Evans wrote:
>
>> What are the top three user goals when they go onto facebook?
>
>
> 1. Gossip
> 2. Boasting
> 3. Kvetching
> 4. (bonus) Stalking
>
> And just like gossip, the Facebook is not going away any time soon.
>
> Will, think about personas, not about yourself.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Oleh Kovalchuke
> Interaction Design is design of time
> http://www.tangospring.com/IxDtopicWhatIsInteractionDesign.htm
>
>

19 Sep 2008 - 9:10am
Dave Malouf
2005

I'm sorry, but the cynicism is quite startling here. Can't it just
be as simple as 'ambient intimacy'? It's a different model than
Twitter or Plurk, but it really feels the same to me.

Further, it is feature rich in a very approachable way for people
like grandmas and uncles without the creepiness that many feel about
twitter. My wife refuses for that reason, but Facebook is fine (to me
it is creepier).

Further with the application layer, it is also so much more:
1. games
2. politics
3. information gathering through the social network (i.e. I have a
subway status application)
4. Event management
5. Photo & link sharing
6. Blogging

It is all there and for those with deep social networks there
(they've reached their critical mass) it totally makes sense.

Now someone brought up the permanent issue. Can it move? OF COURSE!
the teens left AOL for MySpace in a heartbeat and college students
for Facebook. Many are leaving Yahoo Groups and Google Groups for
facebook now. Can someone else come in and be a google to facebook's
alta vista? SURE! And I HOPE SO.

-- dave

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

20 Sep 2008 - 8:29am
Cwodtke
2004

I think the new front page is completely brilliant. I'm less certain about
the profile page. These two pages are the heart and soul of facebook. The
homepage is more people-centric than ever, and highly engaging and
actionable. The profile page, however, seems to wrested some individual
expression from the user, and that is worth them complaining about.
Self-expression is a powerful need in a social network, and it's what
catpulted MySpace into the seat of power in the first place.

On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 8:10 AM, David Malouf <dave at ixda.org> wrote:

> I'm sorry, but the cynicism is quite startling here. Can't it just
> be as simple as 'ambient intimacy'? It's a different model than
> Twitter or Plurk, but it really feels the same to me.
>
> Further, it is feature rich in a very approachable way for people
> like grandmas and uncles without the creepiness that many feel about
> twitter. My wife refuses for that reason, but Facebook is fine (to me
> it is creepier).
>
> Further with the application layer, it is also so much more:
> 1. games
> 2. politics
> 3. information gathering through the social network (i.e. I have a
> subway status application)
> 4. Event management
> 5. Photo & link sharing
> 6. Blogging
>
> It is all there and for those with deep social networks there
> (they've reached their critical mass) it totally makes sense.
>
> Now someone brought up the permanent issue. Can it move? OF COURSE!
> the teens left AOL for MySpace in a heartbeat and college students
> for Facebook. Many are leaving Yahoo Groups and Google Groups for
> facebook now. Can someone else come in and be a google to facebook's
> alta vista? SURE! And I HOPE SO.
>
> -- dave
>
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

19 Sep 2008 - 10:14am
Chris Stone
2010

FWIW, I blogged on it some weeks ago with the intent to compare the
differences between the two. It wasn't a comprehensive review by any
means but once I saw it I felt like it needed to be done ASAP before I
got too caught up in other things like client projects. Clearly,
everyone has an opinion on this matter, I have one too...

http://blogs.nitobi.com/chris/

Hasta,
Chris

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019

20 Sep 2008 - 8:05pm
Damon Dimmick
2008

Genuine question: People are saying that facebook is obsolete.... Why?
What supplanted it?

jeff lippiatt wrote:
> Weighing in.
> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

20 Sep 2008 - 8:33pm
Jarod Tang
2007

Can't agree more on this.
I also doubt if it's really make the user's life better ( on keep
relationship, yes) from the begining.

Cheers,
-- Jarod

On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:23 PM, jeff lippiatt <jeflip at gmail.com> wrote:
> Weighing in.
> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> Posted from the new ixda.org
> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
http://designforuse.blogspot.com/

20 Sep 2008 - 8:45pm
Jarod Tang
2007

On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Damon Dimmick <damon.dimmick at gmail.com> wrote:
> Genuine question: People are saying that facebook is obsolete.... Why?
> What supplanted it?
It's not a issue on replacement, but more on if it make people's
everyday better, for e.g., by google, you could easily searching for
the information you want, by amazon, you want to get the object you
interested. By facebook, you want to have friends, yes, keep
relationships ( for what?), And it's good to have keep friendship and
share experience, and that's all. The sites does good job on this, and
it's not enough to say it's a game changing stuff.

What'll be next phenomenon?
It definitely should be some one that make people's life better, like
google dose. Like a better traveling experience, a better city life, a
life long better education , etc. And safe food service ( for e.g. ,
taking into account current food safety issue from China and Japan) ,
a better energy friendly living system, etc. The chances are open.

Cheers,
-- Jarod
>
> jeff lippiatt wrote:
>> Weighing in.
>> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
>> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
>> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
>> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
>> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
>> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
>> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
>> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
>> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
>> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
>> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
>> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
>> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
>> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
>> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
>> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
>> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
>> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
>> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
>> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>>
>>
>> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
>> Posted from the new ixda.org
>> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________
>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
>> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
>> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
>> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
> Unsubscribe ................ http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
> List Guidelines ............ http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
> List Help .................. http://www.ixda.org/help
>

--
http://designforuse.blogspot.com/

20 Sep 2008 - 9:15pm
Damon Dimmick
2008

I think I get what you are saying, but I disagree on the idea of google
fulfilling all the needs of facebook. Sure, it can, if all your contacts
maintain a website and you fancy searching for their info, one at a
time, every time you are interested.

I'm not saying that facebook is "game changing," but it does allow for
passive keeping in touch, which is exactly what most people want out of
their non-central relationships. When it comes to second order friends,
we all generally want to keep abreast of their lives and be able to jump
in when something interests us, otherwise stay clear without any negatives.

Facebook allows the kind of active/passive dichotomy that is perfect for
people who don't have the energy to keep in constant active contact with
their networks. You don't have to take part, you don't have to be
engaged, but you can see what's going on, and if you like it or it
interests you, you can reach out.

As far as I know, facebook is almost the ideal scenario for this kind of
user goal, and I don't know if there are other technologies that meet
that need as effectively or efficiently. There are other sites that do
similar things, and they are all contenders, but currently facebook
seems the best suited this particular kind of interaction.

And I would argue that this need for passive contact is actually
something that many of us, maybe a majority of us, intrinsically have.
There are certainly other technologies that dance well around this idea
(twitter, general IM, your basic web log) but facebook's advantage is
bifurcated: it requires little effort to broadcast, and even less effort
to receive. My mother would probably never twitter, but facebook she
understands. My nephew, who's all lightning-fast thumbs and text skill,
still uses it too, because it's easier than sending a message to each of
his 187 friends.

I would therefore argue that calling something "obsolete" because other
choices are available isn't sufficient. I mean, the skateboard is
another choice for getting around a city, but does that make car's
obsolete? For true obsolescence to occur, there must be a better way to
accomplish the goal that the newly-obsolete technology addresses, and
this better way must make the original choice more costly (in a games
theory sense of utility) than the new technology in so far as satisfying
that user goal.

It's certainly possible to keep up with your network via google
searches, twitters, emails, IMs etc. Or, you could just log onto
Facebook and see what's going on with most of your contacts in one fell
swoop by scanning a single page. The energy required to satisfy the goal
of keeping up with my extended network is far lower when I use facebook
than when I use a constellation of other technologies. If and when that
changes, facebook may well become obsolete, but so far it seems to be
the better solution.

However, if we're just talking about "trends" and such, well, then sure,
Facebook may be moving towards obsolescence (if you believe it has
crested or jumped the shark). But still, that implies something better
coming along.

Just my thoughts.

-Damon

Jarod Tang wrote:
> On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Damon Dimmick <damon.dimmick at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Genuine question: People are saying that facebook is obsolete.... Why?
>> What supplanted it?
>>
> It's not a issue on replacement, but more on if it make people's
> everyday better, for e.g., by google, you could easily searching for
> the information you want, by amazon, you want to get the object you
> interested. By facebook, you want to have friends, yes, keep
> relationships ( for what?), And it's good to have keep friendship and
> share experience, and that's all. The sites does good job on this, and
> it's not enough to say it's a game changing stuff.
>
> What'll be next phenomenon?
> It definitely should be some one that make people's life better, like
> google dose. Like a better traveling experience, a better city life, a
> life long better education , etc. And safe food service ( for e.g. ,
> taking into account current food safety issue from China and Japan) ,
> a better energy friendly living system, etc. The chances are open.
>
> Cheers,
> -- Jarod
>
>> jeff lippiatt wrote:
>>
>>> Weighing in.
>>> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
>>> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
>>> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
>>> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
>>> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
>>> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
>>> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
>>> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
>>> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
>>> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
>>> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
>>> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
>>> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
>>> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
>>> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
>>> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
>>> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
>>> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
>>> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
>>> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>>>
>>>
>>> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
>>> Posted from the new ixda.org
>>> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________________________________________
>>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
>>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
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20 Sep 2008 - 9:47pm
Jarod Tang
2007

Hi Damon,

On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 11:15 AM, Damon Dimmick <damon.dimmick at gmail.com> wrote:
> I think I get what you are saying, but I disagree on the idea of google
> fulfilling all the needs of facebook. Sure, it can, if all your contacts
> maintain a website and you fancy searching for their info, one at a
> time, every time you are interested.
Maybe my refer to google leads the confusing, here for google example,
i set to say it makes life better.
>
> I'm not saying that facebook is "game changing," but it does allow for
> passive keeping in touch, which is exactly what most people want out of
> their non-central relationships. When it comes to second order friends,
> we all generally want to keep abreast of their lives and be able to jump
> in when something interests us, otherwise stay clear without any negatives.
>
> Facebook allows the kind of active/passive dichotomy that is perfect for
> people who don't have the energy to keep in constant active contact with
> their networks. You don't have to take part, you don't have to be
> engaged, but you can see what's going on, and if you like it or it
> interests you, you can reach out.
>
> As far as I know, facebook is almost the ideal scenario for this kind of
> user goal, and I don't know if there are other technologies that meet
> that need as effectively or efficiently. There are other sites that do
> similar things, and they are all contenders, but currently facebook
> seems the best suited this particular kind of interaction.
>
> And I would argue that this need for passive contact is actually
> something that many of us, maybe a majority of us, intrinsically have.
> There are certainly other technologies that dance well around this idea
> (twitter, general IM, your basic web log) but facebook's advantage is
> bifurcated: it requires little effort to broadcast, and even less effort
> to receive. My mother would probably never twitter, but facebook she
> understands. My nephew, who's all lightning-fast thumbs and text skill,
> still uses it too, because it's easier than sending a message to each of
> his 187 friends.

Ah, it maybe depends on the culture/area difference. For myself, I
have facebook account and MySpace account, but use it very few, and
also found this from my friends. And IM serves the relationship keeper
well for this case. [But I agree Facebook/MySpace/Linkden do well on
the relationship keeping.]
>
> I would therefore argue that calling something "obsolete" because other
> choices are available isn't sufficient. I mean, the skateboard is
> another choice for getting around a city, but does that make car's
> obsolete? For true obsolescence to occur, there must be a better way to
> accomplish the goal that the newly-obsolete technology addresses, and
> this better way must make the original choice more costly (in a games
> theory sense of utility) than the new technology in so far as satisfying
> that user goal.

Agree fully.
>
> It's certainly possible to keep up with your network via google
> searches, twitters, emails, IMs etc. Or, you could just log onto
> Facebook and see what's going on with most of your contacts in one fell
> swoop by scanning a single page. The energy required to satisfy the goal
> of keeping up with my extended network is far lower when I use facebook
> than when I use a constellation of other technologies. If and when that
> changes, facebook may well become obsolete, but so far it seems to be
> the better solution.
>
> However, if we're just talking about "trends" and such, well, then sure,
> Facebook may be moving towards obsolescence (if you believe it has
> crested or jumped the shark). But still, that implies something better
> coming along.
>
> Just my thoughts.
>
> -Damon
>
> Jarod Tang wrote:
>> On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Damon Dimmick <damon.dimmick at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Genuine question: People are saying that facebook is obsolete.... Why?
>>> What supplanted it?
>>>
>> It's not a issue on replacement, but more on if it make people's
>> everyday better, for e.g., by google, you could easily searching for
>> the information you want, by amazon, you want to get the object you
>> interested. By facebook, you want to have friends, yes, keep
>> relationships ( for what?), And it's good to have keep friendship and
>> share experience, and that's all. The sites does good job on this, and
>> it's not enough to say it's a game changing stuff.
>>
>> What'll be next phenomenon?
>> It definitely should be some one that make people's life better, like
>> google dose. Like a better traveling experience, a better city life, a
>> life long better education , etc. And safe food service ( for e.g. ,
>> taking into account current food safety issue from China and Japan) ,
>> a better energy friendly living system, etc. The chances are open.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- Jarod
>>
>>> jeff lippiatt wrote:
>>>
>>>> Weighing in.
>>>> Facebook became obsolete a while ago. Soon to become the relic of
>>>> Yahoo, aka Geocities.
>>>> All of these sites will eventually fail unless they address something
>>>> of value. Currently they are all riding the plummet of social
>>>> entertainment. They have mainly ignored their core audiences: Myspace
>>>> was music, Facebook was college students and grad students. Both have
>>>> annoying advertisements that have no context...just battering people
>>>> over the head to make advertising money on which is steadily
>>>> declining...How long do you really need to stay on either site to
>>>> catch up? Not long, because all of the new changes you can get a
>>>> snapshot of everything now in under 5 minutes. That leaves no
>>>> incentive to stay on the site. All the widgets and mini-apps that bog
>>>> down both sites are 99% pointless because people just add and delete
>>>> them sometimes within hours or minutes.
>>>> In summation, you can't please everyone any of the time. They
>>>> abandoned their niches and have been sliding downhill since. Social
>>>> entertainment is not robust enough to keep users online and engaged.
>>>> I use both Myspace and Facebook, but am not pleased with either. I
>>>> use them mostly for keeping up with friends and birthdays and posting
>>>> pictures of my some what ridiculous but fun cooking antics.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
>>>> Posted from the new ixda.org
>>>> http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=33019
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________________________________________
>>>> Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
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>>> ________________________________________________________________
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>>> To post to this list ....... discuss at ixda.org
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Cheers,
-- Jarod
--
http://designforuse.blogspot.com/

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